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Go Back   Armchair General and HistoryNet >> The Best Forums in History > Current Events > East Asia and the Pacific

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East Asia and the Pacific China - Japan - Australia and challenges throughout East Asia.

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  #91  
Old 04 Mar 14, 05:36
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Originally Posted by Bwaha View Post
So when do I get my check?

On a more serious note. Make peace. Not threats.

The PRC is not known for loving its people or others...

Please make a change before it's too late...

Why did Christian missionaries sacrifice all to go there?

Love for the other...
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  #92  
Old 04 Mar 14, 09:46
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Wasn't Yuan Dynasty Invation of Japan demonstrated Chinese Naval prowness to the world along with the first gun powder warfare in history??? In 13th Century??? The Mongolian were lousy weatherman, but gun powder usage and Naval Power were unchallenged at the time. According to National Geographic," it was probably the best in the world at the time."
First, many of the ships used in the Mongol invasion of Japan were built in Korea, and Koreans were among the troops in the Army (as well as Han Chinese). Second, there is a difference between Green Water navies and Blue Water navies, and China's (like Korea's) was historically Green Water, not a deep ocean Blue Water Navy (their present capability). A single century in China's 3,800 years does not render China a historical naval power. Blame the late Mings for that.

Second, the failed Mongol invasion may well have been defeated by the Japanese on the beaches. But thanks to the Kamakazi, we will never know.

Third, some National Geographic writer's aside that China's naval power was "probably the best in the world" at the time is hardly proof of fact.They could have as easily said: "Maybe". And then, Maybe not. What is undisputed is that the the "South Sea Peoples" (the Chinese term for peoples that included some of today's Southern Chinese) were maritime traders and raiders.

As for your reference to the extermination of Native American peoples by the U.S. Army, you really need to do some serious study to properly address that, which in any event is irrelevant to the topic at hand.

FOr Gman and Bwaha: As regards 19th Century missionaries in Northeast Asia, they were crucial to both China's and Korea's development in both positive (medical and educational improvements, etc) and negative (Boxer and Donghak reactionary movements) ways. But what struck me was the missionaries contribution to Chinese and Korean language studies. These were not graduates of some month long bible study course, but the products of top U.S. universities with degrees in more than Divinity. They set up schools on the latest western models, along with medical clinics, nursing schools, teacher colleges, etc. An example of what they are still doing in Asia is the Eugene Bell Foundation. One of them was even Chinese.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charlie_Soong
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Last edited by lirelou; 04 Mar 14 at 09:58..
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  #93  
Old 05 Mar 14, 13:44
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Originally Posted by lirelou View Post
First, many of the ships used in the Mongol invasion of Japan were built in Korea, and Koreans were among the troops in the Army (as well as Han Chinese). Second, there is a difference between Green Water navies and Blue Water navies, and China's (like Korea's) was historically Green Water, not a deep ocean Blue Water Navy (their present capability). A single century in China's 3,800 years does not render China a historical naval power. Blame the late Mings for that.

Second, the failed Mongol invasion may well have been defeated by the Japanese on the beaches. But thanks to the Kamakazi, we will never know.

Third, some National Geographic writer's aside that China's naval power was "probably the best in the world" at the time is hardly proof of fact.They could have as easily said: "Maybe". And then, Maybe not. What is undisputed is that the the "South Sea Peoples" (the Chinese term for peoples that included some of today's Southern Chinese) were maritime traders and raiders.

As for your reference to the extermination of Native American peoples by the U.S. Army, you really need to do some serious study to properly address that, which in any event is irrelevant to the topic at hand.

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National Geographic did note that some of the ships were not designed for blue water, but many ships were made for blue water. They also were note not sure why greenwater ships were used along with bluewater ships. Perhaps due to shortage of ships. They also noted that the Mongolian Soldiers many have never been on open sea before, probably suffering sea motion sickness, which crippled their fighting capability.

I know the mentioning of US Army killing American Natives is a sensitive topic and also obsurd in the topic, but it's revalent in a sense that the Japanese Security in 1972 mentioning of Senkaku Islands is also obsurd to Chinese. How can you give something away that is not yours. Was there an American Occupation of Senkaku Islands? To the Chinese/ Taiwanese (we tend to forget that Taiwanese is the true interest party, China is acting on their behalf, as most Taiwanese do support Chinese intervention here), the American position is obsurd as well.

Many American (I am not sure if it's arrogant or ignorant), simply says since we are mighty and as the world police; whatever we say it goes. I know Bill O'Reily already calls Senkaku as "Japanese Islands". When Jimmy Kimmel made the "killing Chinese" to get rid of US debt with China inccident; Bill O'Reily also said it was not a big deal, since "Chinese does it too". I watched Chinese Television all the time, I've never seeing chanting death to America of burning of American Flag by the Chinese. Believe or not Chinese still have very high respect for American, and also have not forgotten American assistance to fight the Japanese. However, Chinese do feel betrayal by American by supporting Japanese on Senkaku issue.

I know you sir, know your Asian history much more then average people; unfortunately I think most politians do not, especially Obama (I'm sorry, I just cannot not call him the "President"). For someone who grew up in Indonesia and Hawaii; who cannot tell the difference between Taiwan and Thailand; what kind of Asian friends did he make. I've never seen any Asian friends or organization supported his Presidency.
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  #94  
Old 05 Mar 14, 13:58
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I know the mentioning of US Army killing American Natives is a sensitive topic and also obsurd in the topic, but it's revalent in a sense that the Japanese Security in 1972 mentioning of Senkaku Islands is also obsurd to Chinese. How can you give something away that is not yours. Was there an American Occupation of Senkaku Islands? To the Chinese/ Taiwanese (we tend to forget that Taiwanese is the true interest party, China is acting on their behalf, as most Taiwanese do support Chinese intervention here), the American position is obsurd as well.
The U.S. Army killing Native Americans is NOT a sensitive topic. It is a gross over-generalization bordering on a baldfaced lie. Easily accepted by Americans who don't read books and get their history from movies and television. The Americans had as much right to push west as the Ching did to establish a permanent Chinese presence on Taiwan. And it wasn't done by wholesale extermination of the Indians. Proportionally, there are at least as many Native Americans left as there are Taiwanese aborigines.

ps, you mean to say: "absurd".

Back on topic...
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