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  #1  
Old 14 Jun 14, 13:04
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Was Rosecrans a retreat or a route from Chickamauga.

Wow. This is so much up in the air I wouldn't begin to know where to start.
So y'all others probably have some good answers as it seems getting opinions
is not a problem.

I was there in April at the battlefield but didn't get into a great deal of discussion which way it was. And didn't know enough about the battle to ask the questions.

Which book covers the retreat the best?

Marshall
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  #2  
Old 14 Jun 14, 15:09
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As to the op question - it's a mix. Many troops from the Union right were routed after the the major attack of the Confederate left wing under Longstreet. Rosecrans, McCook, and Crittenden were swept up in this initial panic. However, several troops on the right, such as Wilder's brigade, and those troops who could rally on Horseshoe ridge or in the confines of Kelly Field remained. These troops, along with Thomas's, held on until nightfall and managed an organized retreat.

As for a book covering the retreat the best, I'd have to say Dave Powell's map book.
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Old 14 Jun 14, 18:27
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Originally Posted by semperpietas View Post
As to the op question - it's a mix. Many troops from the Union right were routed after the the major attack of the Confederate left wing under Longstreet. Rosecrans, McCook, and Crittenden were swept up in this initial panic. However, several troops on the right, such as Wilder's brigade, and those troops who could rally on Horseshoe ridge or in the confines of Kelly Field remained. These troops, along with Thomas's, held on until nightfall and managed an organized retreat.

As for a book covering the retreat the best, I'd have to say Dave Powell's map book.
Did Rosecrans have a legitimate reason for going to Chattanooga and leaving the fight?
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Old 14 Jun 14, 19:37
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Did Rosecrans have a legitimate reason for going to Chattanooga and leaving the fight?
I think Rosecrans may have been under the initial impression that the entire army was routed or about to be, especially when his efforts to rally McCook's broken command failed, at least until he reached Chattanooga and was informed that Thomas was in still in the fight. He then made efforts to ride back to the field, but was talked out of it by his chief of staff Garfield, who rode back to the field instead.
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Old 15 Jun 14, 06:30
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I think Rosecrans may have been under the initial impression that the entire army was routed or about to be, especially when his efforts to rally McCook's broken command failed, at least until he reached Chattanooga and was informed that Thomas was in still in the fight. He then made efforts to ride back to the field, but was talked out of it by his chief of staff Garfield, who rode back to the field instead.
Was that a setup to help get rid of 'Rosie'?
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Old 15 Jun 14, 08:48
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Was that a setup to help get rid of 'Rosie'?
This sounds like the conspiracy theory stuff out of Varney's book. I have to say no.
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Old 14 Jun 14, 19:27
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I think Rosey's perception was that he was cut off from Thomas, so he withdrew and hoped for the best.
Wilder could have turned left (North) and made life miserable for Rebs, he would be catching some in the rear and others by the flank. He was ordered (lawfully or not he didn't know) to retreat and make way for the trains and head for Chatt.
After the hills were taken, Thomas had no other choice but to retreat, the Regulars were the last ones standing after all others retreated and were pretty much wiped out.
I really take McCook and Sheridan for their withdrawal without orders and not looping around to aid Thomas.
I'm sure Grant wouldn't have been so magnanimous if any commander had left the field without orders- they were lucky they were not part of Thomas' command.
The fight had gone out of old Rosey, by that time.
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Old 14 Jun 14, 23:24
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There were a few things that made the whole battle tough for Rosey-
What to do about Longstreet bringing reinforcements (didn't Halleck promise Burnside would be there?)
When they did retreat , their only course was to hole up in Chatt. until men and supplies came. (men came 11th and 12th Corps) but without supplies, they couldn't be useful.
Halleck wavered until after the elections who to send to Rosey. (so Burnside wouldn't be of any help at all!)
Grant was pretty smug about making the "cracker line' happen, but he had Sherman there as well, who could have been sent before the battle of Chick. to help Rosey, but that didn't happen.
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Old 14 Jun 14, 23:47
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but he had Sherman there as well, who could have been sent before the battle of Chick. to help Rosey, but that didn't happen.
Because nobody, not just Grant, thought it necessary or expedient at the time. Attempting to shift blame to Grant for Rosey losing Chickamauga is pure silliness. There are a myriad of reasons that Rosey lost the battle that aren't necessarily his fault, but Grant really is not one of them.
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Old 15 Jun 14, 13:04
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Because nobody, not just Grant, thought it necessary or expedient at the time. Attempting to shift blame to Grant for Rosey losing Chickamauga is pure silliness. There are a myriad of reasons that Rosey lost the battle that aren't necessarily his fault, but Grant really is not one of them.
Not from what I read- Lincoln and Halleck were vacillating between Sherman going and Burnside going, the result was no one wound up going, even with orders Burnside didn't go- the reason was the politics of the E. TN for the election.

Even after Sharpe (intelligence agent) notified Lincoln that Longstreet was going South, Halleck still didn't act.
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Old 15 Jun 14, 13:33
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Not from what I read- Lincoln and Halleck were vacillating between Sherman going and Burnside going, the result was no one wound up going, even with orders Burnside didn't go- the reason was the politics of the E. TN for the election.

Even after Sharpe (intelligence agent) notified Lincoln that Longstreet was going South, Halleck still didn't act.
Which is entirely on Halleck. Not Grant.
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Old 16 Jun 14, 06:32
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Which is entirely on Halleck. Not Grant.
Indirectly, yes.
Lincoln (and Halleck) allowed Burnside to disobey orders.
Lincoln (after discussions with Halleck through Grant) kept Sherman in MS.
I am quite amazed that the furthest aid was the one chosen (11th and 12th Corps)...just sayin' that Sherman moved pretty fast under his own dime, plus he had horses and artillery.
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Old 15 Jun 14, 14:09
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Not from what I read- Lincoln and Halleck were vacillating between Sherman going and Burnside going, the result was no one wound up going, even with orders Burnside didn't go- the reason was the politics of the E. TN for the election.

Even after Sharpe (intelligence agent) notified Lincoln that Longstreet was going South, Halleck still didn't act.
Well!! Varney must know what he is talking about because he says the same thing!

What book did you get THAT out of?
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Old 15 Jun 14, 00:17
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Burnside's lack of movement during the Chickamauga is puzzling. The withdrawal of Buckner's corps to Bragg's army practically removed all opposition to his front. There was nothing from stopping the 9th Corps and 23rd Corps from reinforcing Rosecrans in bulk. I realize Lincoln placed a great deal on having a Federal presence in Knoxville, but I don't think two corps were required to hold the place.
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